The are a lot of tools you can use to defend yourself. People are simply chosing to not use them.

We dont bother with sec tags. Even when open to pvp from everyone people wont attack us.

You could also finish shaving your head while you're at it.

Or is that a helmet?

More or less. We own the testigram so ratting staus back up isnt too much of a drama but we only bother doi g that if we a running some kind of operation for the CFC.

Then advocate the removal of faction police, simple as that.

With very few exceptions(the only one I know of is faction warfare trade hub camping), they HAVE to hide in station. It's not just the smart move, it's the only not-stupid move. They aren't really able to do anything else thanks to repeated punitive mechanics leveled at them at the behest of carebears over the years.

But since it was carebears themselves who caused this situation, if they're crying about it now, then I shall laugh in their faces. They cry about fairness, when the current unfair situation is entirely of their making. To put it more simply, they made their bed. If they don't like how it looks, they should have put some forethought into it in the first place.

The final solution :
- All players disabled in 1.0-0.9
- Instant death in 0.8-0.7
- No concord in space

Issue solved.
1.Every one is safe in 1.0-0.9
2.Instant death
3.More fun

From my perspective whole concord is a bad idea.
But no one is willing to remove it.
This way at least some systems will be free.

....lol ok so that's balanced? To gank you invest 10m isk and a weeks worth of sp. To defend against a gank....

For the first time, I am seriously considering leaving nullsec and starting up a freighter protection service. It seems like the environment is right for a lucrative venture to be made of this.

For all the crying gankers do about the counter plays to a gank....

May have sounded cool in the Dark Knight movie, but doesn't apply to EVE online, which is a computer game. If a group of players just want to watch the game burn, they are probably having a negative affect on the game.

I just see one issue here CCP should take a look at: bumping.

All Freighters were bumped 200+ clicks off the gate by a Machariel. And this is absurd. Those Freighters have no chance to align and warp off. In the meantime the gankers form up, warp on grid first at warp in range to the Freighter, CONCORD shows up, they warp on top and gank. More CONCORD shows up. This will additionally create lag.

However. This is just my pov. CCP has to look into this because at a special point this kind of gameplay might be an exploit.

Sorry for starting a rage thread from this point

The code dictates that flying afk is not permitted and any permits are invalidated if a pilot is caught afk. In such case when a freighter pilot with a permit jumps to, say, Aufay at it's prime is now considered afk and their permit be invalidated.

By my interpretation that means exposing yourself to the presence of gank team in said system makes them able to "get you" thus making the previous quotation mean you were afk by their interpretation. I hope that clarified my point of view.

If they did I expect the subscription numbers would drop even further, people don't tend to like extortionist. Plus of course they don't have to put up with such behaviour when they pay to play.

People keep on about people leaving this game, I don't find that too surprising myself with the increase in ganking anything that moves and the increase in corps resorting to extortion. I mean it shows it's getting bad then an alliance forms just to do those activities.

I've played since 2005 although I have had some breaks and I've noticed the difference over that time.

buy a permit, get ganked anyways, get told you violated your permit by what amounts to undocking..

Not surprising, as it's a bit like a bully in a playground stealing a kids dinner money.

neither I nor any of my alts have ever been ganked by new order or any affiliates of them. they tried sure when i used to mine back in the day but failed every time.

CODE as the revolutionary working class? That's actually very funny.

Never been a pirate in this game although have considered it. But if I was I'd go and live in CURSE.
So don't really know how the rep works for pirates. I would expect it to work in the same/similar way to how rep works between races.
I would expect pirates that have a terrible rep with CONCORD to be shot at by them.
From what you seem to be saying that doesn't happen.

If they did biomass their CONCORD calling char afterwards without facing the consequences of the negative sec status, these bans were justified. If they didn't, they should have petitioned the ban as it was NOT justified.

I don't doubt what you're saying, but the word from Lead Game Master Grimmi carries much more weight than a ruling from a GM further down the foodchain.

Nonetheless I'd welcome an up-to-date official statement from CCP, that can be easily found and linked to, that once and for all puts an end to the rumour mongering.

Actually the kid could get the bully sorted if the kid had the resources. But that's the thing it's all about having the resources (and the skills trained in this game). I was forgetting one thing though which was selling kill rights, assuming anybody want to buy them.

It is a legitimate tactic if you don't biomass that alt without getting his sec status up again. But it won't help you much as the one CONCORD spawn will only deal with one of the many gank ships. You'd have to bring more at once, depending on the size of the gank fleet.

it's a misunderstanding. one concord fleet is summoned per ganker, but only one fleet will kill all gankers in range

e: a misunderstanding not on your part. also i lost my place in this thread and i don't know where to start reading

lol no, used to afk mine all the time.

see, what's the joke is that this 'code' is a sham. simply if code managed to gank you, regardless of what you were doing, you broke the code. while real life criminal orginizations actually do leave you alone if you pay 'protection' money, codies dont even have that common decency, making up reasons why they gank certain pilots and not others.

I've made my point

how do you think I managed it ;)!

code is a joke.

To be honest I think that the code mafia being successful is appalling, because it shouldn't work if people were playing a bit differently. Hence spreading the joy about relevant stuff helping people to mine while being more or less AFK is the way to go.

No one is talking about botting, that's not possible outside of null sec space, it's just doing more interesting stuff while your game keeps making money to pay for what you enjoy doing. Keeping an eye on it is definitely a good start but one fact remains: if you're not a worthy target you won't get ganked, unless they're idiots. Denying that fact on the other hand, is just the evidence of an unending flow of hate towards some people's gaming choices.

Don't be hateful, spread joy, and profit with cheaper ore and ships!

freedom in a sandbox game is more valuable than some people's inner emotional need to force others to be clones of themselves. Live and let live.

I will provide gas masks. At some point, everyone will fly in procurers with 100k+ EHPs while gently orbiting a small plagioclase deposit and making fat cash while stabilizing the economy.

Like I said the main issue was people were too greedy and were willing to show-off in overly expensive exhumers fitted with overly expensive modules for max yield purposes. Having more modest ambitions is the best way to make more profits. No one will ever pay attention to a procurer with a lot of HPs. It's considered as a cheap noob mining barge only scrubs fly. Which is great because boing unnoticed is the first step towards safety. Having your own orca and mining with it, on the other hand, well, you're going to lose it no matter what you do. Unless you're mining with corp mates but then it's an entirely different story.

Hello,
I am a Kulak (I have absolutely no idea what that means).

The Orca does not need to be on grid. When dealing with bumpers, the freighter is docked up and the individual barges are sent in orbit around individual asteroids. The lack of a freighter does cut into the income by 10%-15% but alas, the bumpers leave because I've still won.

I am not blind to the effects I have multiboxing, though. CCP needs to consider the impact it has on the game. There is nothing outside of high-sec - besides PI and moon mining - that is remotely worth the effort of a multiboxer. The more it's allowed the more people will do it and the more we'll have dudes worth 11, 12, even 13 figures who made that entirety in high-sec.

I posted here because I saw someone complaining about the code. I read stuff about the code and laughed at the bad strategies they're using. It's extremely easy to completely ignore these guys. I'm not opposed to people using 10 accounts if they want. Why not, they're paying for dev hours and ultimately content after all. I'm just opposed to saying that ganking is a serious business. It's a joke and should be treated as such. They aren't heroes, they are zeros. There's nothing heroic in killing an unprepared target. :p

Now we're on page 30 and most people who should read my post about how to completely ignore gankers to the point that staying AFK should be safe most of the times won't do it and are just going to post some stuff after reading the OP.

Now, maybe we agree. I don't know. But i find ganking not being educational at all. Most of the times it's just an appalling opportunity to send a tell saying "we killed you for your tears". Which is a lie. I think that posting anti gankers fitting stuff is more useful. I also think that people should be allowed to play the way they want, even if it includes no social interactions at all, because it's in the code, if you do things right. Maybe it's going to make these players mad at me but I don't care, I only fly cheap stuff.

Trying to force everyone to play your way is an appalling behaviour in a MMO. We're all here for the same reason, which is having fun. I'm not sure paying a tax to the mafia is "fun", and even if i won't force everyone to fly the way I fly I'll tell them they can if their purpose is to do what they want to do without having to deal with others.

No, I got it, you're saying that the game is dying because people don't want to go to null sec.

So you're saying that people mining while being more or less AFK is bad for the game, that it's killing high sec active mining with people actively playing the game. I, on the other hand, think it's completely neutral. Prices only adjust accordingly. Mining is less profitable but ships are cheaper, crafted modules are cheaper, etc. You just end up with some people having a few millions or billions more ISKs but since the ones you're concerned about are mostly miners and won't engage in any other activity, that's like money sitting on dead accounts. Again, it's neutral.

It's simply bad business.

i'll admit, i haven't had time to read this thread in the last few days. however, i've got a bit of free time today and i think 40 pages of carebear tears about ganking might be a great way to pass the time.

let me grab some snacks and get comfortable.

Bin Laden was never punished by any agency for any of the actions he took credit for.
Gankers on the other hand are punished for each and every crime they commit in highsec, unlike real life law enforcement Concord have a 100% conviction rate.

It's also a very tasteless, not to mention terrible, comparison and verges on breaking the rules when it comes to discussing both politics and religion. You should be proud of yourself

Blowing up your 15mil ISK ship is "punishment", oh the hilarity.

Just how poor are you?

Come up with a better term, and no not everyone is punished, the scout, the scanner, the supplier, the bumper (all key players in the gank) all go completely unnoticed by CONCORD and since you brought up real life, in real life accomplices get charged.

having half read half of the thread (the repetition and whining is tedious).

we've given freighters a straight buff against being ganked, and people are still whining about it...
what, exactly, is their outrageous demands this time?

if the beloved dumb idea of fittings didn't save their miserable carcasses, what else do they want changed that also won't save them?

This is why these forums badly need a "dislike" button.
Because I'm far too lazy to report personal attacks.

Stop talking about the war!

You started it

We did not start it!

Yes you did, you invaded Poland

The amount of **** I had to read by these people makes me want to join CODE,
just to make a point (I'm for hire for PR btw) and to blow the freaking **** out of them.
The hating carebears. Forever. And it's good for the game as a whole too!

Aha. I had no idea you started suicide ganking.

Are you trying to seduce me? ;)

Awww and I thought you're trying to hit on me... :/

Well it's attitudes like yours, why there's so much bitching in the first place.
Still, I'm sure CCP appreciates your efforts to get rid of their customers.

there's less online than there used to be and it's also noticeable that the systems I fly through have less people in them than what they used to have.

I've been in and out of this game since around mid 2005

Ill pre-empt your reply to that, I know that you dont care if I believe you.

I don't actually care if you believe me or not, it's likely you will choose to disbelieve me anyway..

Easy way to check, if we can find the highest figure for online players. Obviously the normal amount at that time would be slightly less.
Sunday afternoon/evening (GMT) always was the busiest time. Probably best to check from around 16:00 (GMT) onwards.

The discussion was never about less people in hi-sec specifically. It was about EVE online losing subscriptions.

A -10 character, or a character with sec status below the accepted system minimum requirement should not be able to chain gank people. They should be barred from boarding a ship in high security space, or at least barred from entering warp in any ship except for a pod. It's exactly the same as when a concord flagged player tries to undock in a ship or board a ship, concord has you blocked from activating your warp drive. If concord can already do this, then there's no reason why they can't do this automatically to players who fall below the minimum system security status. They can still travel through empire in a pod, they just can't chain gank people. It's stupid that concord would allow this to happen.

So you're claiming that anyone who uses nullsec never gets ganked in hi-sec? Very false.

The fact that you're trying to win arguments by nitpicking just proves how desperate you are to look like you are in the right.

Well, in low you lose the minor protection of the gate guns at outlaw levels, iirc.

Exactly, ganking is part of the problem. When players are ganked relentlessly, in any game, a lot of them quit that game. EVE is no exception. Given enough time, players learn how to abuse systems. The systems are old and are being abused to the point that suicide ganking is done even to targets of no value, just for killmails and the hope that someone has an expensive pod full if implants.

The system needs an update to curb this behaviour.

40 hours a week? That's nothing, I used to play from 12 - 16 hrs a day and I don't even use any add-ons, including illegal ones.

If you were to put all my gaming time together it would amount to around 14 years. Probably more towards the extreme end of gaming.

So 14 years of gaming, that's actual playing time, you don't think is extreme. Well I'm impressed there are people out there that have spent more time playing than I have.

If people really believe that removing the faction police will suddenly
make all these gankers not hide in station all day ...
... and encourage players to hunt and kill them ...

... you'll probably have a bad time once this propaganda bullshit about the faction police stops ...
... and they are removed from the game.

Waffle

]Wow ... you too start with this bullshit.

How about adressing the post, instead of going ad hominem?

Do you have anything valid, actually about the topic to say,
or do you prefer being a parrot, spreading misinformation and lies?


Do you have ANY practical proof that the faction police is such a big issue?

I have LOTS of proof I can practically show you, that they aren't !


I don't need words to prove a point, I can easily show you.

But everybody else seems to only have words to make a claim that's practically wrong.

I agree with Sol on this one. I don't think he's playing devil's advocate.

-10 is a self imposed limitation.

Eliminating FacPo doesn't affect auto-yellow on -10

Getting rid of FacPo would contribute nothing to player-to-player interaction. The "auto-yellow" will cause players to dock up anyway.

If you want auto-yellow at existing sec status thresholds like -4.5 (or -2 in 1.0) then it might seem like less of an attempt to create ganker easy mode.

But that still doesn't demonstrate how it would change anything at all in player-to-player interaction.

Your FACE is a sportsfan!

This is what I think:

1. Eliminating FacPo and making auto-yellow on -10 makes it too easy. No FacPo for -4.5 to -9.9, allowing use of BS. And we gain nothing from this because no one could freely shoot at -4.5 to -9.9.
2. Making auto-yellow on -1 makes it too hard. It would wreck the desire a lot of players have to do bad things because anyone could shoot at them for just about anything. Even the current sec status thresholds are too harsh, in my opinion. It would destroy crime in hisec because currently there *are* ways around FacPo (encourages players who play smarter).

I don't like either because they both seem worse than current implementation.

Edit: I feel like I'm misunderstanding proposal #1. My fault, if that's the case.

Whats with all of this auto-yellow at -10?

At -10 you are an outlaw and can be shot at already.

Gû¦Gû¦ this is the potential of removing facpo. The impact on suicide ganking is less important.

The trouble with removing FacPo is no one gives a shizzle about him next door. I would hazard a guess that a fleet of 20 or so Anti-gankers, following the gankers would eradicate them. Even CODE would soon disappear, as it would soon become boring for the bandwagonners, without the kills Try getting those 20 or so players, PVE'ers just don't care, until their ship blows up. Then the either rage quit, or just buy a new ship.

Point conceded. I agree with your assessment.

Btw, great job on that portrait, Sibyyl. No reason NPCs should mess with you.

I'll shiv you in your sleep. <3

I am going to have to make a ganker alt, and I blame you. Hope to see Aufay soon!

its kinda funny because suicide ganking only got worse after the retribution patch that was supposed to help curbe this.

It's just that to some people it doesn't actually look like RP.

Hence the confusion to what high sec suicide ganking squads are all about.

IT IS BECAUSE A WIZARD DID IT, ergo, it's WoW in space.

OFC there is, Blizzard hated it that their company sounded like Wizard - Blizzard / Wizard.. so renamed them to: Shaman, Priest, Mage, Druid, Paladin...

Indeed, if your most powerful expressions of reason include the phrases "naked swamp parties" and "YeeHaw", I could see how you won't get far with religious people . . . or people interested in productive reasoning with you.

You hate carebears so much it bleeds through almost every post you make, yet you are upset over your perception that someone else is being bigoted? That's rich.

Shamans and mages don't count?

Thread temporarily locked for cleaning.

I guess it was only time before the New Order gave up ganking miners.

You seem to be against people whining on the forums and yet you do it so well.
It is every Eve players god given right to through the teddy bear from the pram. Get use to it!

Then what would we do for entertainment?

BUT anyone who doesn't feel the same about the situation are just bored, wants to see the world burn and/or ruin other peoples game.. all the time.

THEN maybe CCP should get rid of autopiloting because that's what it's used for AFKing big ass ships.

Nah you seemed to be butthurt about AFK piloting players my friend, maybe they need to wipe yours. Let's stick to the true problem here.

But do we have an answer to the thread title yet?

Should I even bother reading through what I missed ...
... or is it as one can expect?

Just throw in a random "NO YOU!" and you'll be fine.

So just to summarize.. Highsec carebears should be spending far more time and effort while they carry out some of the most mind-numbingly boring tasks in Eve such as spending 3 hours flying a freighter or staring at an ice field until they go insane? Every high sec mining op should include the same precautions as a low sec roam but without any of the actual fun bits? .

1. Flying manually obviously takes more time because they have to pay attention instead of randomly rickrolling people on the Hello Kitty Online forums. (Is rickrolling still a thing?).
2. Mining safely is like a roam because you'd have support ships and scouts and the ability to GTFO before things go too badly.
3. Not right now, but I can't speak for anyone else in the thread.
4. Paris, France or Paris, Texas? You need to be specific.
5. I burned it. Sorry.
6. In my pants.

The only thing that has changed is a load of annoying roleplayers

So please tell us Ramona, why has ganking gotten harder over the years? Not the specific changes, but why CCP keep making it harder? What do you think might have caused that?

The simple fact is: there is no gank epidemic. It's a myth. A lie. A complete non-issue that only exists because people are stupid and/or don't take precautions......
All the precautions you scoff at work. They have worked for years and they work now. The reason we know they work is because they don't show up on the killboards in any volume and because ganking is ridiculously low as it becomes harder and harder to gank, requiring the gankers to pick easer and easier targets in order to actually by successful.

Personally I think it should be an executable offense, but hey ho.

please do not make up creatures

elephants are ridiculous and obviously not real

wait, ankylosaurs are real? i thought you were making up the name of a creature for a joke

Ah so we've moved from 'Show me the data!' to 'The data is obviously wrong!'. Ok then..

Hmm, I also looked at Red Frog as a corp to see their freighter losses. They lost one in a June, in 2013. June 29th to be precise but it was a Fenrir which is why it won't have showed up on the Charon search.

As a corp (according to zkillboard) they lost..

2 in 2011
4 in 2012
8 in 2013
and 6 to present in 2014. That would seem to represent the same kind of increase the other figures showed.

Red Frog don't lose many freighters. Given that we were looking at the numbers for only the Charon, it's hardly that surprising that they didn't lose any during the month of June, given how low their total losses are.

They aren't immune, as those figures showed despite their great record of safe hauling even they have seen a sizeable increase in losses.

I do believe Red Frog pilots fly under npc corps to avoid war decs. I assume that would be why it shows no losses.

Even if you drop out anything earlier then 2012 do to unreliability there is still a huge trend upwards with each year doubling its predecessor.

Edit: 2014 is actually on pace to triple 2013

From my personal experiance I'm happy to report ganking is down. Only 99,998 players left to poll.

Absolutly, from a personal perspective ganking is down. But those numbers, man that is a tough one to explain away, especially 2013 and 2014, really wish we had more data. Be interesting what the final year tally comes out to and if the gankers can continue to improve into 2015.

All we can really say for sure is that RF got better at performing their core business - getting boxes from here to there without losing them.

A 'stupid ship'. Thanks, you just summed up your take on this very nicely.

Yes well done, when a group go around blowing up large numbers of other peoples stuff in high sec, that's the fault of the people getting shot. Except in the many, many instances where it demonstrably isn't.

I don't need any help with my own safety thanks, I'm not the one losing ships. I'm the one doing my ganking in low sec where when you pop a retriever in a belt you can genuinely say he deserved it for choosing a course of action that he could reasonably expect to be dangerous..

LMAO that was stink but could just as well be sink depending on the application.

I didnt. Was my original name before the forum warriors reported it and they made me change it. Sure it was some type of forum glitch.

Please learn what words mean.

In other words Hi-Sec miners need to have a hard lock on their mining ships at proc level, thus extending even further the tediousness of their grinding?

Funny how all your input on this subject seems to end up being 'miners deserve whatever they get'. I'd love to see how you feel about ship prices if all those miners stop mining.

Couldn't you take her as a trainee slave and teach her?

Btw, wb crazy woman, I missed you (a bit).

Kal, come back! Tell us more about The Great Miner Strike!

I don't mine, so I can pretend to be on strike if it helps.

I could even riot a bit and shoot a couple of rounds at the Jita monument.

That proves that suicide gankign is too easy compared to waging war. If cost of suicidign is to be this one, then wars shoudl cost 10 times less than now.

The proc has half the ore bay of the ret.

Why do you care that highsec is a boring place full of dumb noobs and people who are happy doing things that are pretty boring?

Sorry, you were waiting for me to acknowledge your anecdote? Really? Well I'm sure your personal experience with both your friends proves your entire case, well done.

This is so utterly and mindnumbingly wrong that it's hard to even find words..

I personally dislike how easy it is to gank freighters in highsec, but that isn't to say they should be safe. If anything I think the inflation of the EVE economy is the problem here (if there is a problem), not the ships themselves.

Personal note: Tier 3s BCs should lose 1-2 turret slots only becuase the gap from tier 1+2 BCs to BS is to great and the T3BC is too close to battleship DPS - even though it is "paper thin".

W(here)TF did you learn how to spell?

Your argument is invalid.

Just lost the last 2 or 3 months worth of work to a pirate attack.
Done with this game.

You'd think that losing a pod, on average, every 3 days, would make him realise that

1. He's doing something very very wrong
2. People will shoot at him, because they can
3. WoW or any other MMO that isn't Eve is probably more to his taste, and abilities.

Code. kills

was fun to watch the other day all them freighters lol

it use to be a ban able offence if you eluded concord this was implemented back in the day when mOw would tank concord and kill anything that came at them lol.

it has gotten way to easy to do and them stats show it. Yes a lot of no tank setups but still lol

well simple you undock you get a concord warning you insta warp away eluding concord is just that simple

ok simple fix then anyone with a -5 - -10 should be automatically criminal flagged fraction police should only be used on those that have the -5 or lower standings :)

no fuss no muss

I know the game mechanics lol

As we all now see and know, gankers live in unavoidable bottlenecks, thus being unavoidable.

Hardly? The problem is, while sure a grief gank here and there isn't necessarily game breaking, the act of it happening every time you are needing to go through a particular area that requires the use of a bottleneck system with no legit way around could cause a lack of enthusiasm for playing the game. Freighters are practically defenseless, no way for one to get a chance at survival unless the FC of the gank fleet screws up somehow. Maybe a special type of point defense EW system is needed. An AoE weapon that is designed to only target and cripple ships hostile towards you, and that can only be fitted on freighters.

[quote=Organic Lager]

Yet it is far more likely that the amount of traffic through Uedama that was freighters and other haulers, during that 24 hour period, was in the region of several hundred, not three.

When you let one group of players mercilessly grief another set, you lose players.

fun fights, good conflict with response from both sides, etc.

That, and the game doesn't do much to make it appealing. Revenge is hard to come by in a lot of aspects of EVE, but I think this is too much the case (this is most true in HS, which seems wrong). The desire for revenge has the potential to create great cycles of game content, but in EVE it's common to shoot once and have the buck stop there. E.g. things like kill rights and bounties seem great in concept, but in practice they're not very effective.

9:45 PM
7/16/2014
Uedama 0.5 Jita - Dodixie Trade Route

Number of Jumps Per Hour
1083 jumps in the last hour.

Number of Ships Destroyed Per Hour
183 ships destroyed in the last hour.

(1083 / 183) * 100 = 16.900% chance of being ganked.

Food for discussion.

Erm. Before the recent changes to mining barges & exhumers can flipping was alive and kicking. A lot of Procurers were using the can-flipping method especially in asteroid belts but maybe not in ice anomalies. I don't patrol ice anomalies so I don't know about them. Of course I am talking about ISBoxers corporations here as they have so many miners they find jet-canning easier.

Ah um. I may have crossed purposes as you probably mean swapping the ore into YOUR jetcan to seek an engagement. I was thinking of just emptying two jetcans at a time into a T1 ore transporter. Nereus is it ? I forget. Anyway that was fairly profitable as well as being a good way to control excessive mining before the latest mining vessel update.

Meh. Just throwing some more tears on the threadnaught to feed the crows.

Main was ganked. Double bulkheaded freighter, carrying a billion with nothing dropped. Killmail from the day the launcher showed the warning shows two CODE members doing 18k damage each with Hammerhead I's outstripping damage from their cohorts using t2 neutron blasters, and too few pilots for it to otherwise succeed. Ticket says that the logs show no one using drones and that killmail must be display bugged.

So I went to quit industry, when I realized that with the past two expansions being mostly industry, there's nothing left I want to do. Between one main and two alts I've done everything except titans and wormholes. No content left. So I've canceled subscription and will use the remaining 77 days as an off grid booster for some friends at which point I'll sell off everything valuable including the main, transfer the isk to them, and biomass the two alts who have served their purpose.

I leave the rest to you gentlemen. Enjoy the profits (tears included). You've earned them.

I am amused and entertained by this topic. Please continue.

D:

YOU HATE ME!!! D:


D:

Suicide ganking is completely broken in terms of penalty and risk vs reward.

One question I have is, Why do suicide gankers feel entitled sit on a gate in high sec and wait around for a fat juicy noob to come hauling his entire worth?

Why should suicide gankers get special treatment when it comes to risk vs reward?

The fact that CODE is making an industry out of blowing up empty freighters (at a loss), bumping ships to allow for multiple waves of ganks, and doing it all quite comfortably with -10 sec status, shows that something is seriously broken here. Ganking for profit - great, I'm 100% in support (I used to check out the combat kills for the starter corp to see some guys gank wreathes with 1 bil + in cargo). But that's not what CODE is doing, they are ganking just to cause tears, and often doing so at a loss. They don't care to bring up their suicide status between ganks (as profit/loss oriented gankers do), rather they are happy to be career criminals who do nothing other than ganking. The fact that there is no serious punishment for this is absurd. Personally I think anyone with -5 sec status or below should draw faction police within 5 seconds, forcing them to go to low/null and raise their sec status before operating in empire.

I actually don't haul, mainly because I think that CODE has affected the risk/reward of it

They have killed quite a number of those, please check their killboard and get back to use with details. And there are very good reasons why most haulers don't use those, cost, capacity, etc....

what I find fascinating here is the will of knowledgeable posters to argue with someone who doesn't even show signs of the input reaching his braincells

But ... you're wrong!
(meta post)
Also, as I remember right now ...
I really liked that one. (:

I also think that CODE is pushing things in a negative direction by, inter alia, ganking empty frreighters.

And personally I am fine with suicide ganking, when done to make a profit, and subject to reasonable risk/reward. I think that CODE is breaking the balance, and hence why I am raising these issue on the forums.

You are the only one making an issue out of nothing,
just like the CODE propaganda machine keeps doing.

It's just 1+1=2, you know?

You accused me of being a CODE alt, I provided you with conclusive evidence to the contrary. This is the point where you apologize and ask forgiveness.

Market demand? Considering the very small moving quantity for T2 industrials vs the quite high moving quantity of T1, I fail to see where you get the demand from. Since there is a strong correlation between demand and moving quantity.

I'd very much argue they are used less considering the low market demand.

I can grant you that.

I'm happy to continue doing so, but your side needs to stop throwing around "moron" and "idiot' every second sentence.

anti-gank intel channel

.I think any reasonable person sees CONCORD in high sec as having a quasi-police function.

Web the freighter, warp to celestial, warp to a safe, warp to an intercepter in your fleet in your alignment cone etc..

CODE is blowing freighters up at an alarming clip.

CONCORD should react as a competent "law enforcement agency" would, and help free pinned targets.

Saying, bring friends, etc.... doesn't line up with the role of CONCORD in highsec, which is to punish criminal conduct.

And pinning down a target for a gank, whether through warp scrambling or through other means rendering them unable to escape, is, in my view, a criminal act.

In essence, the only options are suicide ganking or no suicide ganking, and therefore no changes need be considered.

My analysis was based on the CODE killboard, their website, my intel channels, my experiences in Uedama, and the increasing frequency of complaints by freighter pilots. Those points are all unassailable. Obviously hard numbers would, I believe, further support my position.

Actually, to the extent that CODE is growing and now targeting more freighters, I think that (1) is pretty obvious. As for (2), refer back to the OP and ganking empty freighters, done purely for tears and to drive people out of the game, which I think most people would consider bad for Eve.

It's snowing outside, so the earth must be cooling.

Maybe you should pick 20 other random highsec systems and observe there for a while and not only the one system we ganked Freighters in the last month.

Also, it should be easy enough for you to check of the number of freighters blown up in the last 2 month has been increasing...a lot of people here seem to doubt it.

circumstantial evidence is overwhelming

(1) it is broken in terms of risk/reward/penalty, and (2)the victims are primarily newer and casual players who are preyed upon due to the commonality of them being unfamiliar with concord response times.

they are also in love with fatigue wearing cigar smoking dictators.

Yes, and I provided strong circumstantial evidence for it.